Comments on: The Pirate Problem http://www.dancohen.org/2008/04/22/the-pirate-problem/ Covering the intersection of digital technology and research, teaching, and learning in the humanities, including search, data mining, website development and design, and programming. Sun, 20 Jul 2008 16:24:20 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5.1 By: Early Modern Notes » Interactive digital history http://www.dancohen.org/2008/04/22/the-pirate-problem/#comment-2451 Early Modern Notes » Interactive digital history Thu, 10 Jul 2008 09:04:26 +0000 http://www.dancohen.org/?p=284#comment-2451 [...] The Pirate Problem (Dan Cohen) [...] [...] The Pirate Problem (Dan Cohen) [...]

]]> By: Archives Found » Thinking about the traditional vs. the possible http://www.dancohen.org/2008/04/22/the-pirate-problem/#comment-2356 Archives Found » Thinking about the traditional vs. the possible Sun, 08 Jun 2008 04:02:27 +0000 http://www.dancohen.org/?p=284#comment-2356 [...] that continue to evolve with the internet. I recently stumbled across the blog of Dan Cohen, and this post from April really grabbed me. Dan is talking about a workshop at UNC-Chapel Hill where a group of historians [...] [...] that continue to evolve with the internet. I recently stumbled across the blog of Dan Cohen, and this post from April really grabbed me. Dan is talking about a workshop at UNC-Chapel Hill where a group of historians [...]

]]> By: Dan Cohen http://www.dancohen.org/2008/04/22/the-pirate-problem/#comment-2233 Dan Cohen Tue, 29 Apr 2008 00:30:55 +0000 http://www.dancohen.org/?p=284#comment-2233 Evidently this post came off as a little too polemical and either/or, to use Tim's description. (Serves me right for going with the cute pirate theme.) Regular readers of this blog and of my book <i>Digital History</i> will know that I've long advocated a combination of close and distant reading, of digital and analog methods, and the careful application of technology (including understanding its disadvantages in addition to advantages). Evidently this post came off as a little too polemical and either/or, to use Tim’s description. (Serves me right for going with the cute pirate theme.) Regular readers of this blog and of my book Digital History will know that I’ve long advocated a combination of close and distant reading, of digital and analog methods, and the careful application of technology (including understanding its disadvantages in addition to advantages).

]]> By: Mattie T http://www.dancohen.org/2008/04/22/the-pirate-problem/#comment-2232 Mattie T Tue, 29 Apr 2008 00:20:22 +0000 http://www.dancohen.org/?p=284#comment-2232 As someone who holds a master degree in History and an MLIS, I agree with Tim Lacy. It is not an either/or, nor should we as librarians/archivists insist that historians do it "our way." I think both tech. will be useful in the future. As someone who holds a master degree in History and an MLIS, I agree with Tim Lacy. It is not an either/or, nor should we as librarians/archivists insist that historians do it “our way.” I think both tech. will be useful in the future.

]]> By: Rob Jenson http://www.dancohen.org/2008/04/22/the-pirate-problem/#comment-2229 Rob Jenson Sun, 27 Apr 2008 15:34:54 +0000 http://www.dancohen.org/?p=284#comment-2229 <a href="http://lonearranger.livejournal.com/3142.html" rel="nofollow">So I see the historian as the pirates. We just have to remember that there are more pirates among us than we thought. Arrrgh!</a> So I see the historian as the pirates. We just have to remember that there are more pirates among us than we thought. Arrrgh!

]]> By: Of Pirates, Treasure Chests and Keys: Improving Access to Digitized Materials - SpellboundBlog.com - spellbound by archival science and information technology in the digital age http://www.dancohen.org/2008/04/22/the-pirate-problem/#comment-2211 Of Pirates, Treasure Chests and Keys: Improving Access to Digitized Materials - SpellboundBlog.com - spellbound by archival science and information technology in the digital age Thu, 24 Apr 2008 04:05:41 +0000 http://www.dancohen.org/?p=284#comment-2211 [...] Cohen posted yesterday about what he calls The Pirate Problem. Basically the Pirate Problem can be summed up as “there are ways of acting and thinking that [...] [...] Cohen posted yesterday about what he calls The Pirate Problem. Basically the Pirate Problem can be summed up as “there are ways of acting and thinking that [...]

]]> By: The Challenge of Digital History « Digital Clio http://www.dancohen.org/2008/04/22/the-pirate-problem/#comment-2208 The Challenge of Digital History « Digital Clio Wed, 23 Apr 2008 22:28:05 +0000 http://www.dancohen.org/?p=284#comment-2208 [...] Challenge of Digital History Dan Cohen over at his blog writes about “The Pirate Problem” in digital history. He says that “the digital humanities represent a scary, rule-breaking, [...] [...] Challenge of Digital History Dan Cohen over at his blog writes about “The Pirate Problem” in digital history. He says that “the digital humanities represent a scary, rule-breaking, [...]

]]> By: Tim Lacy http://www.dancohen.org/2008/04/22/the-pirate-problem/#comment-2207 Tim Lacy Wed, 23 Apr 2008 18:27:52 +0000 http://www.dancohen.org/?p=284#comment-2207 My problem with Dan's post, and apparently the attitude behind it, is the either/or thinking. Who says we can't have the best of the old ~and~ new worlds. Even if, according to John's post, we're dealing with a "new" ocean, the old rules of sailing still apply. Close reading will ~never~ go out of style, but the ways in which we ~arrive at~ those documents which we read closely might. The older historian shouldn't have seen herself as a metaphorical crab. She should've seen herself as traveler returning to a once-visited location, but who needs an updated chamber of commerce map to understand the new homes and businesses that had gone up on her familiar streets. - TL My problem with Dan’s post, and apparently the attitude behind it, is the either/or thinking. Who says we can’t have the best of the old ~and~ new worlds. Even if, according to John’s post, we’re dealing with a “new” ocean, the old rules of sailing still apply. Close reading will ~never~ go out of style, but the ways in which we ~arrive at~ those documents which we read closely might.

The older historian shouldn’t have seen herself as a metaphorical crab. She should’ve seen herself as traveler returning to a once-visited location, but who needs an updated chamber of commerce map to understand the new homes and businesses that had gone up on her familiar streets. - TL

]]> By: Robert B. Townsend http://www.dancohen.org/2008/04/22/the-pirate-problem/#comment-2206 Robert B. Townsend Wed, 23 Apr 2008 16:26:08 +0000 http://www.dancohen.org/?p=284#comment-2206 I was with you right up to the point where you insisted that this threatens "all this." I don't understand why it isn't enough to say some computer savvy members of the profession will really benefit from these new resources and tools and can open up new areas of scholarship. In the meantime, Google books and other online databases are helping the average historian (the kind who purposely avoided statistics and computer programming courses in college) to open up their research to a wider range of material and dig into it in new ways. And hopefully in the long run, as new tools make those materials more accessible to those average historians, this should open new areas of work in the discipline. After all, the cliometric historians thought they would transform the entire discipline too, but now they all seem to be teaching in more lucrative social science departments. I was with you right up to the point where you insisted that this threatens “all this.” I don’t understand why it isn’t enough to say some computer savvy members of the profession will really benefit from these new resources and tools and can open up new areas of scholarship. In the meantime, Google books and other online databases are helping the average historian (the kind who purposely avoided statistics and computer programming courses in college) to open up their research to a wider range of material and dig into it in new ways. And hopefully in the long run, as new tools make those materials more accessible to those average historians, this should open new areas of work in the discipline. After all, the cliometric historians thought they would transform the entire discipline too, but now they all seem to be teaching in more lucrative social science departments.

]]> By: C. C. Pugh http://www.dancohen.org/2008/04/22/the-pirate-problem/#comment-2205 C. C. Pugh Wed, 23 Apr 2008 10:44:34 +0000 http://www.dancohen.org/?p=284#comment-2205 That's not really what I took away from "Everything," or particularly accurate. It's more the case that digital tools allow us to access and use information in ways much closer to how we already understand it then previous models. It's like Deleuze said, the book is a machine. You take it and you plug bits of it that you like in to other bits elsewhere and make new things from it, the problem with physical books is that what you take from them, the information, is so heavily tied to their physical form. Archival filing is even less about being able to link information in books, because it's even less about moving through an information space and even more about maintaining the physical forms of the sources. That's always a Good Thing, but it's also never how people using those sources will think about them once they've gone away. That’s not really what I took away from “Everything,” or particularly accurate. It’s more the case that digital tools allow us to access and use information in ways much closer to how we already understand it then previous models.

It’s like Deleuze said, the book is a machine. You take it and you plug bits of it that you like in to other bits elsewhere and make new things from it, the problem with physical books is that what you take from them, the information, is so heavily tied to their physical form.

Archival filing is even less about being able to link information in books, because it’s even less about moving through an information space and even more about maintaining the physical forms of the sources. That’s always a Good Thing, but it’s also never how people using those sources will think about them once they’ve gone away.

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